Is it really cheating? If people want to team up that's fine.

*shrug* Sounds like it works.

This sounds like a traditional "pre-alliance" problem. It seems the only way we can change anything is if we have a set way of diplomacy(Age-of-Empires style) because now, anything can happen, with no set restrictions on this.

what is the "Age-of-Empires style". I am not familiar wit is. Would you explain?

If it is a good idea and if it can be incorporated, I am sure Ryan would consider it. He a good guy and seems to like to listen to what others have to say here.

Well, during or before the game, you could check a box on a menu with whom you are allied. They would have to do the same in order for the alliance to work. This could be available at any time during the game, and there could be penalties to off-set the advantage with allies (say, the two biggest players, or uneven teams. This would be in relation to the rest of the field, as of how many territories they own, or something).

Penalties could be, say not being able to attack your ally (might not be much, but hurts if you want an ally to give support by breaking through a territorial barrier, or whatever needs.) Or, odds reduced (I don't even think that is feasible work by Ryan) or another suggestion of loss, maybe even points combined in whichever place they finish are split.

There are several ways you could implement this w/ penalties, but I have no idea if this is even right for kdice. Just a thought!

I should disagree agro... the only rules for this game you will read in the left bar on the tables.

Everything else is anarchy... that´s the amazing stuff about this game - like ryan said himself: diplomacy is a part of this game, even as anti-diplomacy...

So it´s on our society to give a penalty to the so-called "cheaters" (I personally disagree with this word) or backstabber or whateve, but it can´t be a part of the rules...

to Alpha: I didn´t joined your game, but if these two guys made, what a lot of players are doing, this was not "cheating".

Please, test it yourself and start some games with a secret alliance!! I´m sure, you will remark that are not so much benefits for pre-game-alliances as you think now, but much more handicapps by doing it!
The problem is, that such alliances are only remarked by the other players, if they are sucessfull. But even more games such alliances lose then they win ´cause a bad placement in the start, or ´cause they can´t attack each other only ´cause they would weak him to much - but with the consequence that they can´t connect their territories. So they lose both...

I played myself a lot of games in "old trusted friendships" or you would call them "pre-game-allies" (but I never spoke about... we´re doing it ´cause we know each other and - that´s important we know to TRUST in each other...), and also I´m a skilled player, playing on the +1900-tables with actually more then 2000 points...
Sometimes, when I can´t find any friends, I´m playing alone, sometimes I´m playing together with friends... I´m losing by playing with alliances as wel I´m winning games playing alone... so wtf?

Try it out, to see, that it´s not that evil as you pronounce!


But WHY I´m playing with such pregameallies you may ask now??
So I like to play in teams, ´cause I enjoy a social interacting with my friends, remarking that we´re thinking the same things is wonderfull... it´s great! Winning a match mean also to share... I like sharing with friends... it´s really nothing evil, but another way to enjoy this game!